1 WINDSOR CHARTER TOWNSHIP
2 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
3 JULY 13, 2005
4 DIMONDALE, MICHIGAN
5 7:00
6
7 Planning Commission Board Members present:
8 ARNOLDO MARTINEZ - Chair
9 RICK BORUCK - Vice Chair
10 DAN BLAIR - Secretary
11 DAVE KUBICEK - Board Member
12 FRAN JOHNSON - Board Member
13 SANDY PRAY - Board Member
14 MURRAY MARSH - Board Member
15
16 ALSO PRESENT:
17 VERN FOUNTAIN - Consultant
18 JIM FOULDS - Consultant
19 LINDA TOWSLEY - Clerk
20 SHANE BOLLEY - Township Attorney
21
22
23
24
25
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 1
1 Wednesday, July 13, 2005
2 Dimondale, Michigan
3 7:00 p.m.
4 THE CHAIR: The July 2005 Windsor
5 Charter Township Planning Commission will come to
6 order.
7 A couple house cleaning chores before we
8 get started. We do have one public hearing. I want
9 to clarify a couple things about that.
10 First of all, the same rules apply. We're
11 here courtesy of the First Presbyterian Church.
12 Please respect that at all times.
13 When individuals are talking, be courteous,
14 no side conversations. If you have the urge to have
15 a conversation, please feel free to go out in the
16 hallway and have that conversation.
17 Turn off all your cell phones, please.
18 We'll limit comments to three minutes
19 unless the chair decides otherwise.
20 No arguing in the audience.
21 Of course, no profanity, as we stated
22 before.
23 And all comments should be addressed to the
24 chair.
25 Okay. The first item on the agenda is a
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 2
1 public hearing for the Chapman special use permit.
2 I've had a couple questions come up from individuals
3 who called me at home and said, is this a continuance
4 of the public hearing for the Michigan Horse Park?
5 No, it is not. That hearing was held last
6 month and concluded at 9:47 p.m. That hearing is
7 closed.
8 The public hearing tonight is for the
9 special use permit for Chapman.
10 Having said that, is the representative
11 here for Mr. Chapman?
12 MR. JOHNSON: Yes. Jim Johnson.
13 THE CHAIR: Would you come up close to the
14 front in case we need to ask you questions, please?
15 MR. JOHNSON: Okay.
16 THE CHAIR: This is a special use permit
17 public hearing for the applicant, Mr. Mike Chapman.
18 MR. JOHNSON: Correct, Chapman Brothers,
19 Mike and Rick Chapman.
20 THE CHAIR: This is a request for
21 Mr. Chapman for approval of the special use permit
22 for purpose of constructing and operating a
23 construction office on the property located at 8454
24 Billwood Highway?
25 MR. JOHNSON: Correct.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 3
1 THE CHAIR: The applicant proposes to
2 construct private property to allow for development
3 of six new construction offices, each new building
4 will measure approximately 75 feet by 120 feet. The
5 existing building, barn, and site will be used for
6 the same purpose.
7 The existing zoning district was just
8 recently zoned B-2. According to the zoning
9 ordinance section 583 allows for this type by special
10 use permit.
11 It is presently vacant with the exception
12 of residence, buildings, and barn.
13 Access to the site will be from Holt
14 Highway.
15 MR. JOHNSON: Correct.
16 THE CHAIR: And the applicant submitted
17 proposed use and concept, although site planning
18 shows the property is proposed for development. Each
19 building will have four to five employees?
20 MR. JOHNSON: Correct.
21 THE CHAIR: Each building will have four to
22 five parking spaces?
23 MR. JOHNSON: Correct.
24 THE CHAIR: Hours of operation will be 7:00
25 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 4
1 All the other information you submitted in
2 your special use permit application is the same?
3 MR. JOHNSON: Yes, it is.
4 THE CHAIR: Okay. Verifying the
5 information is all the same, is there anyone here who
6 wishes to speak in reference to this special use
7 permit request?
8 MS. HARRISON: What are they going to be
9 doing in the building?
10 THE CHAIR: I went through that.
11 MS. HARRISON: I didn't hear.
12 THE CLERK: We need your names and
13 addresses from anyone who wishes to speak.
14 MS. HARRISON: Sarah Hock-Harrison, 141
15 East Quincy Street, Dimondale.
16 What are they going to be doing in the
17 building? What kind of project or business is it?
18 THE CHAIR: Thank you. You may answer that
19 question.
20 MR. JOHNSON: One is Chapman Siding. He
21 has a small construction type office in Lansing now.
22 The other one is a carpet cleaning business, one half
23 of the building. They have five employees.
24 The others are speculation. Maybe third
25 tier people from GM plants.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 5
1 MS. HARRISON: All right.
2 THE CHAIR: Is there anyone else from the
3 public that wishes to make comment and/or ask
4 questions?
5 Hearing none, this closes the public
6 hearing on the special use permit. Thank you, sir.
7 MR. JOHNSON: Thank you.
8 THE CHAIR: We'll move to the regular items
9 on the agenda and convene the business meeting.
10 Is there any public here that wishes to be
11 heard on a planning commission issue of Windsor
12 Township?
13 Hearing none, we'll move to the next item.
14 The next item is to approve the minutes of
15 the past meeting, previous meeting.
16 Has everybody had a chance to review the
17 minutes? Any additions or corrections?
18 Hearing none, the minutes stand.
19 The next item, the report Mr. Blair, Board
20 of Trustees.
21 MR. BLAIR: Yes, we've had now
22 three -- we've had three township board meetings
23 since our last planning commission meeting.
24 Just to bring you up to speed on a few
25 things, starting last night we did have a request for
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 6
1 a liquor license. The township has two remaining
2 liquor licenses on top of the two that are currently
3 issued. And what we decided last night was we would
4 wait until we had a firm request with a proposal to
5 go along with the request we just got, just to
6 basically put a place holder on those for the
7 particular individual. So we decided, until there
8 was a firm business that would need them, we didn't
9 want to go ahead and issue those. So that was last
10 night's meeting.
11 At the meeting of the 28th, probably the
12 key thing to tell you about there is we set a public
13 hearing for August 9th. I think I mentioned a couple
14 meetings back maybe that the sewer board, we had
15 discussed the possibility of changing to quarterly
16 bills. And we have to have a change in our school
17 ordinance to be able to do that. So we set the
18 public hearing for August 9 at 7:30. That's prior to
19 the regular township board meeting. So there is
20 that.
21 At the meeting before that, on June 14th, a
22 couple of things. We did grant -- the township board
23 did grant the special use permit to WILS for the new
24 towers on Smith Road as we had recommended.
25 And also we had talked before about the
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 7
1 possibility of extending the water that's now on
2 Creyts Road down around to the property on Billwood.
3 We're still working on that project.
4 But we did receive, at that meeting, a petition from
5 Grand Point subdivision requesting they become -- the
6 subdivision become part of the project. And I don't
7 remember how many people -- do you remember what the
8 percentage was that signed it?
9 THE CLERK: Not quite two thirds.
10 MR. BLAIR: It was not quite two thirds,
11 but enough for the board to take action. We will be
12 exploring the possibilities of getting Grand Point
13 hooked up to the Board of Water and Light for that
14 project.
15 That's all I've got to report.
16 THE CHAIR: Mr. Kubicek.
17 MR. KUBICEK: There were no appeals since
18 the last meeting so there is nothing to report at
19 this moment.
20 THE CHAIR: Thank you.
21 THE next item on the agenda is a request
22 for a special use permit by Mr. Lundberg.
23 MRS. LUNDBERG: Right here.
24 THE CHAIR: Okay. The property 5102 Bailey
25 Road, Dimondale, Michigan, correct?
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 8
1 Tax parcel number 080-013-400-080-00,
2 correct, by description of your property?
3 MRS. LUNDBERG: Yes.
4 THE CHAIR: You are the owners Keith and
5 Patricia Lundberg?
6 MRS. LUNDBERG: Correct.
7 THE CHAIR: The address there is different.
8 Is it 5358 Bailey Road.
9 MRS. LUNDBERG: That's our residence.
10 THE CHAIR: Zoning of the property
11 presently is ag. Lot area is 80 acres. And proposal
12 for the property is a remodeled farm house to
13 establish a bed and breakfast, correct?
14 MRS. LUNDBERG: Um-hum.
15 THE CHAIR: You don't know at this time,
16 hours of operation, apartment requirements, or
17 anything like that?
18 MRS. LUNDBERG: Well, they would be the
19 typical hours of operation. Most people check in at
20 4:00 and leave at 11:00, but you are only open when
21 somebody calls and makes a reservation. So you are
22 not actually open every day.
23 THE CHAIR: Okay. Is there anything else
24 you wanted to add to our application?
25 MRS. LUNDBERG: I'd be willing to answer
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 9
1 any questions anybody has.
2 THE CHAIR: We probably won't have a lot of
3 questions because we'll set it for public hearing.
4 At the public hearing we may have questions.
5 MRS. LUNDBERG: All right.
6 THE CHAIR: The chairman will entertain a
7 motion to set a special use permit for a bed and
8 breakfast for the next meeting.
9 MR. MARSH: Moved.
10 THE CHAIR: Seconded by Mrs. Johnson that
11 we set the Lundberg special use permit for a public
12 hearing at our next meeting which is August 10, I
13 believe.
14 THE CLERK: The 10th.
15 THE CHAIR: Okay. All those in favor,
16 signify by saying aye.
17 Opposed nay.
18 Motion carries.
19 Next item on the agenda is the cricket site
20 plan, final site plan. Who is the representative
21 here?
22 MR. BROWN: Pat brown with L.D. Clark
23 Building Company.
24 THE CHAIR: Good evening. How are you?
25 There are a couple vacant chairs, if you don't mind
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 10
1 coming up, in case there is a question to be asked.
2 Are you the spokesperson?
3 MR. BROWN: Yes, sir.
4 THE CHAIR: And this is submitted by the
5 L.D. Clark Building Company, 5851 Millet Highway in
6 the name of Larry Doris Clark.
7 The whole description is lot 3848 Westland
8 Park, Number 2, subdivision on the part of the
9 southeast one quarter of section 34, Delta Township,
10 part of the northeast quarter section 3 TNR 3 W
11 Windsor Township, Eaton County, Michigan, Eaton
12 County records.
13 Have you had a chance to discuss the final
14 site plan requirement with our planner, Mr. Foulds?
15 MR. BROWN: Yes, I have.
16 THE CHAIR: Were you provided with a copy
17 of the final site plan requirements that we need?
18 MR. BROWN: Yes, I was.
19 THE CHAIR: Okay. Let's just go over those
20 very quickly. The written detailed description of
21 the proposed use.
22 A number of site plan copies, 12 copies
23 provided in a readable scale.
24 Information provided in site plan
25 documents.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 11
1 Existing development.
2 Zoning and property information.
3 Zoning district of the site and adjacent
4 parcels.
5 Land use of the site and Adjacent parcels.
6 Parcel area acres in square feet and/or
7 square feet property line dimensions.
8 Location of the dimensions of existing
9 structures, drive, parking areas and existing signs.
10 Location of the structure of drive, parking
11 area of the adjacent parcels.
12 Proposed development.
13 Proposed location of the structures, square
14 footage and dimensions.
15 Proposed front side and rear yard setback
16 dimensions.
17 Proposed location of parking areas.
18 Proposed location and dimension of vehicle
19 drives.
20 The proposed location and dimensions of
21 sidewalks.
22 Proposed location and dimensions of signs.
23 Details of proposed site lighting plan.
24 Proposed buffer yard plan under Windsor
25 Charter Township zones.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 12
1 Other public agency information.
2 The applicant's accordance to cooperate
3 with other public agencies, Road Commission, Drain
4 Commission, Health Department, public utilities,
5 Michigan Department of Transportation, Michigan
6 Department of Environmental Quality, and the Michigan
7 Department of Natural Resources. The planning
8 commission is required to follow the recommendations
9 of these agency.
10 Site plan procedures.
11 The planning commission will not place the
12 final site plan on the agenda until all information
13 required by this application has been provided.
14 The final site plan application supporting
15 document should be filed 30 days prior to the
16 planning commission meeting.
17 The final site plan application will not be
18 placed on the planning commission agenda until the
19 preliminary site plan review meeting has been held
20 with the zoning administrator.
21 All site plan fees must be paid prior to
22 placing the final site plan application on the
23 planning commission agenda.
24 All applications filed with the Windsor
25 Charter Township clerk at 145 West Jefferson,
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 13
1 Dimondale, Michigan, signed by applicant, Mr. Larry
2 Clark.
3 Is there a comment you wish to make before
4 I have comments from our clients, as well?
5 MR. BROWN: No, other than everything from
6 the preliminary plan review has been taken care of
7 and will be submitted.
8 THE CHAIR: Okay. Thank you, sir.
9 Any comments from the commissioners?
10 Mr. Foulds, we have a copy of your
11 recommendations. Is there any comments that you wish
12 to make?
13 MR. FOULDS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
14 As the applicant indicated, we had a site
15 plan meeting on June 22, at which time many of the
16 issues you reviewed were noted to the applicant. As
17 a result, the applicant resubmitted the information
18 and the site plan document that you have before you
19 for consideration this evening which can be
20 recommended for approval with one addition, that
21 being the July 12 memorandum from the emergency
22 services department, which I'm not sure if the
23 applicant has seen.
24 He has a copy? Very good.
25 And that information can be conditioned on
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 14
1 your approval, in my estimation. So I would
2 recommend the approval of the final site plan
3 documents.
4 THE CHAIR: Okay. Hearing the
5 recommendation from our planning consultant, I will
6 entertain a motion for approval of the cricket retail
7 site plan, final site plan.
8 MR. BORUCK: I move we approve the final
9 site plan to the cricket retail development with the
10 contingency the requirements mentioned by the fire
11 chief are met in the final plans.
12 MR. BROWN: No problem.
13 MS. PRAY: Second.
14 THE CHAIR: Moved by Mr. Boruck to approve
15 the final site plan for cricket with the exception of
16 the requirements from the fire chief are met.
17 And seconded by Mrs. Pray.
18 All those in favor, signify by saying aye.
19 All those opposed nay?
20 The final site plan for a cricket retail
21 store is approved.
22 MR. BROWN: Thank you.
23 THE CHAIR: Now we move to unfinished
24 business, which is the brief public hearing we just
25 had on the Chapman special use permit.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 15
1 Comments from the commission?
2 Hearing none, Mr. Foulds, we have your
3 report. Would you please summarize that and give us
4 your recommendation?
5 MR. FOULDS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
6 As you indicated, the property is zoned B2
7 commercial. The proposed use is a private drive with
8 the development of six new construction offices which
9 requires a special use permit under Windsor Charter
10 Township zoning ordinance property, which is
11 approximately six acres. Access would be from
12 Billwood Highway. Again, based on our general review
13 of the standards for granting a special use permit,
14 which is section 8.1.3 (1), the proposed use can meet
15 and has met many of these standards.
16 I would note that the special use permit,
17 if approved by the township, would require a final
18 site plan to be submitted and approved by the
19 township prior to issuance of any building permit.
20 It is our recommendation that special use
21 permit 3-2005 be approved subject to the approval of
22 a final site plan and endorsement and review of all
23 public agencies that are required to review the
24 development.
25 THE CHAIR: Thank you, Mr. Foulds.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 16
1 Is there any discussion on
2 recommendation?
3 Hearing none, the chairman will entertain a
4 moment for approval based on our planning consultant
5 recommendation as just stated.
6 Moved by Mr. Marsh to accept
7 recommendation of the planning consultant, the
8 planning commission recommended approval of Special
9 Use Permit Number 3-2005 subject to the approval of
10 the final site plan and the endorsement of all
11 agencies requiring review and approval to the
12 proposed development.
13 Support by Mr. Boruck. All those in favor,
14 signify by saying aye.
15 All opposed, nay.
16 Motion passing.
17 We'll set our recommendation to the Board
18 of Trustee.
19 We now move to the Michigan Horse Park
20 special use permit. I need to have a motion to
21 untable this, as we tabled it at the last meeting, so
22 we can move with discussion.
23 MR. BLAIR: I'll make the motion to
24 untable.
25 THE CHAIR: Moved by Mr. Blair. Seconded
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 17
1 by Mr. Kubicek.
2 We'll untable the motion on the Michigan
3 Horse Park special use permit. All those in favor,
4 signify by saying aye.
5 All those opposed, nay.
6 Motion is untabled and we'll proceed.
7 A couple things before we move in that
8 direction, I received some documents that I want to
9 make part -- I want to make officially part of the
10 record. One is a packet of signatures in support of
11 the Michigan Horse Park submitted by Mrs. Kathy
12 Gearhart, I believe.
13 Another is a letter of support from -- I
14 can't read the signature, but the last name looks
15 like Schlee, Kathy Schlee.
16 Another is for support of a special use
17 permit for the horse park from Jennifer Whack.
18 And a packet of signatures in opposition of
19 the horse park submitted by Mrs. Helen Carter.
20 And there may be some other documents that
21 are sitting up here in my stack of papers. As I move
22 through the evening, if I see any that need to be
23 included on the record, I will do so before we move
24 here tonight.
25 This is the time for the commissioners to
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 18
1 ask any and all questions relative to comments made
2 at the public hearing, any additional comments that
3 they -- or questions they maybe want to ask in
4 reference to the horse park issue.
5 And I have passed out a condensed list,
6 based on a report that we'll hear from our planning
7 consultant, that will hopefully help our
8 commissioners be able to ask questions. They don't
9 have to use that. They can come up with their own
10 questions, but they're questions that I think are
11 generic to what we are going to be talking about
12 tonight.
13 So with those comments, here's how the
14 process will work. Only the commissioners will ask
15 the questions. The audience does not ask questions.
16 If we make a decision that we need to ask a person
17 out in the audience a question based on the fact he
18 or she was here and submitted public testimony, we
19 may do that. I will be asking some questions in
20 reference to people that are here. But it is our
21 chance to ask questions and deliberate.
22 The other person I would like to come up
23 and sit in front is Mr. Dorian. If you could be
24 close by in case we need to ask you some questions,
25 we appreciate that.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 19
1 Th further comment is that we are in and
2 about the business of discussing a special use permit
3 application by the Michigan Horse Park, and that our
4 comments and remarks should stay in reference to the
5 standards for a special use permit and only the
6 standards of a special use permit.
7 Having said that, we are now open for
8 comments and discussion from the commissioners. I
9 will indicate some questions. At any point, if any
10 of you feel you want to jump in, please feel free.
11 As I ask those questions, to whoever I ask
12 them to, they are generated from two sources; from
13 the public hearing, and some from my interest and
14 concern on the standards and the special use permit,
15 et cetera.
16 There was some very interesting testimony
17 given here. And let me tell you what our job is --
18 as commissioners, is a very tough job. We have to
19 make sure that we interpret, to the best of our
20 ability, the zoning ordinance as it relates to
21 special use permit. And we will do our very best to
22 do that. And the second responsibility we have is we
23 are appointed to represent the citizens of Windsor
24 Charter Township. And so we'll do our very best to
25 do that. And those are our two responsibilities.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 20
1 We've received a multitude of information
2 from individuals and groups and parties outside the
3 jurisdiction of Windsor Charter Township, and we
4 appreciate that. We will review that and peruse it
5 and do our best to take all those things in
6 consideration, but we have two prime obligations to
7 interpret the zoning ordinance to the best of our
8 ability, particularly as it relates to the standards
9 for a special use permit, and to do our very best to
10 represented our citizens, our residents, tax payers
11 of Windsor Charter Township.
12 Has anyone stirred up any interest in
13 asking any questions?
14 If not, I'll continue. Jump in at any
15 time.
16 I'm going to ask some questions out of the
17 transcript. And, incidently, we've had -- I want to
18 thank my fellow commissioners. We've had an
19 abundance of material. The transcript is 104 pages
20 long. I've received another copy 30, 40 pages of
21 documentation including some more tonight, probably
22 150 pages.
23 If my colleagues are running the same way I
24 am, I received an unbelievable amount of calls at
25 home relative to this issue. It is a very important
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 21
1 issue to the residents and certainly the developers.
2 And so there is a ton of information to review and
3 process. And, in addition to that, all of us have
4 full-time jobs. I'm retired. I'm going into my
5 second retirement, but I don't have all the time to
6 necessarily read all these documents.
7 Be a little patient with me as I go through
8 these pages.
9 MR. BLAIR: Just a suggestion, if you have
10 a comment from the transcript that you want to refer
11 to what page you are looking at.
12 THE CHAIR: Exactly what I'm doing.
13 Going to the transcript, I'll start with
14 page 62 -- let's start at page 25 since I'm there,
15 line 21.
16 This question, inquiry from Mr. Lange, and
17 I am curious about it, but also I received a lot of
18 calls from people here at the public hearing. And
19 they have asked me to find out. There was a comment
20 made as our sheriff was making some comments. And I
21 interrupted because I wanted him to read part of the
22 public comment. I believe you made a statement, "He
23 is a part of our team."
24 And what the citizens want to know and I
25 also -- what does that mean? Is he part of the
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 22
1 developers? What does that mean?
2 MR. DORIAN: No, he was here to, I guess,
3 offer some testimony to the fact that his department,
4 the Eaton County Sheriff's Department, was inclined
5 and would like to put a substation in that area.
6 It's been, I guess, under consideration for some
7 time.
8 He publicly stated he was neither
9 supportive or opposed to the project. And that was
10 part of the public record.
11 And the Eaton County mounted division has
12 asked, and will be granted, the ability to
13 headquarter their division at the horse park if this
14 facility were to become viable.
15 So I think that is all in response to the
16 concern about the possible increase of crime due to
17 this type of facility.
18 THE CHAIR: The question I think you've
19 answered, by being part of the team, he is not one of
20 the developers. He is just merely making public
21 comment?
22 MR. DORIAN: No, no, he is not.
23 THE CHAIR: You've given me knowledge. I
24 was not aware that a discussion or proposal was in
25 the works for additional police protection out there.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 23
1 So I am learning something new.
2 Another comment, page 62, line 4, there was
3 a Mr. Nevai. Is he here?
4 He made a comment that, I guess, he and his
5 wife met with you on at least two occasions. And one
6 of the questions he had asked you do you plan to sell
7 this establishment. That's line 4. And your
8 response was that the possibility is open.
9 That's a concern because is this going to
10 be an operation that when doors are open, it's to be
11 sold immediately? Is that your intention or what
12 does that mean?
13 MR. DORIAN: No, it is not. First of all,
14 the -- a horse park, a racing facility would only be
15 to license, can only be transferred or sold under the
16 jurisdiction of the racing commission.
17 My intent is to keep this as a legacy. I
18 think that I did comment that I am in the business of
19 building ugly industrial buildings with a longevity
20 of 20 to 30 years. This is something that would
21 last, hopefully, for hundreds. And that would be my
22 intent is to keep the property. This is, I think,
23 my -- I know is my fashion, is what I want to do. I
24 have no intention of selling it.
25 We do have -- there is a possibility of
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 24
1 investors coming in, as in all real estate projects
2 can happen, and obviously senior and mezzanine
3 financing, all that kind of stuff. But my intent is
4 to keep the project.
5 THE CHAIR: Okay. Your intention is not to
6 open it up and sell it at once?
7 MR. DORIAN: Absolutely.
8 THE CHAIR: Okay. Thank you.
9 One other last question for you also. I
10 received probably 25-30 calls. In your original
11 Michigan Horse Park packet, this one right here, you
12 have Section 5, page 37, some individuals listed
13 under the resume' section. And the question that was
14 put to me, and I had no answer to give, they see our
15 new representative, Mr. Rick Jones, is there under
16 that resume'. And what is the intent or purpose of
17 that?
18 MR. DORIAN: He was not under resume'.
19 There is letters of support and we received a letter
20 of support as we have hundreds of letters of support
21 from his office. And that was just for an example of
22 the support that we've had. We also had letters from
23 Jim Barrett, the Lansing Regional Chamber, that sort
24 of thing. So he was being included.
25 THE CHAIR: I'm aware of that. But this
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 25
1 packet says he is under resume'. That's what they
2 were looking at. And they didn't know what that
3 meant. It is kind of the same question I had about
4 the sheriff. Is he part of the development process
5 or is he just --
6 MR. DORIAN: I've answered the question
7 about the sheriff. He is not part of the development
8 process. And Representative Jones is a supporter or
9 has written a letter of support. He is not a member
10 of the team.
11 THE CHAIR: Okay. Thank you.
12 MR. DORIAN: If that answers the question.
13 THE CHAIR: Page 51, comment made by a lady
14 in the audience, the name was Mrs. Helen Carter. I
15 see she is here. And she states that she had what
16 she feels, in her opinion, is a threat. I'm not
17 quite sure how that took place.
18 I would like to ask you questions about how
19 that discussion took place you perceive a threat to
20 you.
21 MS. CARTER: I'm very glad to. I called
22 him on the phone because I was told he had some more
23 information about the -- he informed me that, if the
24 horse park didn't go in, that Mrs. Hanks had a
25 trailer park just sitting that could go in at very
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 26
1 short notice. And it was either/or.
2 When anyone tells me it is either/or, that,
3 to me, is a threat. And that's not the first threat
4 we've encountered in this horse park.
5 A couple weeks before that, one of
6 Mr. Lange's supporters was canvassing the
7 neighborhood, dropping off literature. And he also
8 threatened the threat of a trailer park if we didn't
9 go along with a horse park.
10 And, if you want to go back a little
11 farther, last year in April we had an informational
12 meeting at the little school house. And at that time
13 we were also told if we didn't go along with the
14 horse park, there would be a parts warehouse and, of
15 course, the proverbial trailer park.
16 So that's pretty much -- when they say
17 either/or and they keep harping on it, I do think
18 that's a threat.
19 THE CHAIR: There is a side comment from
20 that. Windsor Charter Township is extremely proud.
21 We have done, I think, a tremendous job in providing
22 adequate -- for understanding purposes of everyone
23 here in the room -- trailer park facilities, modular
24 home facilities, affordable income facilities. We've
25 done an outstanding job. Those comments shouldn't be
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 27
1 made. If anyone is going to make a decision on where
2 trailer parks go, that's a decision made by the
3 planning commission and the Windsor Charter Township
4 board of trustees and no one else. So if those
5 comments keep coming up, please refer them to us.
6 We'll try and clarify that as we move down the line.
7 The other comment --
8 MR. DORIAN: If I could comment on that,
9 sir.
10 THE CHAIR: Go ahead.
11 MR. DORIAN: I think Mrs. Carter's on the
12 same page. She says, "The choice of 500 horses or
13 500 modular homes, no contest, I choose the modular
14 homes."
15 Never have I threatened to put in mobile
16 homes because I don't own the property. Mr. Hanks
17 owns the property. I have previously checked with
18 the township and it is my opinion that there is no
19 room for and no need for modular homes or, as Mrs.
20 Carter would say, a trailer park in the area.
21 I think, at the initial meeting at the
22 coffee, so to speak, I was invited to, we tried to
23 present the horse park as an alternative to other
24 possible industrial or other residential projects
25 that could go in there. So never in -- I'm not in
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 28
1 the practice of making threats and I would like to be
2 on the record as saying that.
3 THE CHAIR: Thank you.
4 There was a comment made to that that also
5 drew my attention because it is an issue that we have
6 to deal with. It is a very important issue in the
7 special use permit. That is in reference to entry
8 into the premises. And I'll refer to you page 82.
9 The comment started on line 16 and ended on line 2 of
10 the following page. Those were made by Ms. Wendy
11 Burton.
12 I see you are here. If you don't mind, I'd
13 like to ask you some questions in reference to that.
14 The reason that came to my attention is because I
15 stated previously that is a major concern in this
16 special use permit. And you seem to speak with some
17 kind of authority to the issue. And, if you wouldn't
18 mind, I'd like to ask you, where did you get that
19 kind of information? Maybe you can tell me, who are
20 you employed by?
21 MS. BURTON: My name is Wendy Burton.
22 THE CHAIR: Why don't you take the
23 microphone.
24 MS. BURTON: My name is Wendy Burton. I
25 work for the Michigan Department of Transportation.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 29
1 And, basically, at the public hearing, I cited the
2 Windsor Township's ordinance for special uses about
3 entrances and exits from the development property.
4 And, basically, I quoted the -- your ordinances. And
5 the vocabulary used in those ordinances says that the
6 entrances and exits must be from a major or minor
7 arterial.
8 And, by definition, 96 on Pinch and Lansing
9 Road, at least that segment of Lansing Road, is not,
10 by definition, a major or minor arterial as set by
11 the federal government or the state government.
12 THE CHAIR: I guess the other question I
13 was going to ask you, in your employment, do you have
14 the occasion to review this kind of information so
15 that the information you are giving us is coming from
16 credible sources?
17 MS. BURTON: Yes. If anybody wants to look
18 it up, it is available on MDOT's web site. I can
19 give you the URL to that website or I can give you
20 the actual MDOT site expert about National Functional
21 Classification as it relates to these ordinances.
22 MR. BORUCK: Can you tell me your capacity
23 with MDOT?
24 MS. BURTON: My capacity, I'm a project
25 manager for IT projects.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 30
1 MR. BORUCK: Thank you.
2 THE CHAIR: Thank you, Mrs. Burton.
3 Is there any other comment you want to
4 make?
5 MS. BURTON: I don't have any others.
6 MR. DORIAN: Could I comment on that?
7 THE CHAIR: Yes. Make it brief.
8 MR. DORIAN: Make it brief?
9 THE CHAIR: If can you.
10 MR. DORIAN: A traffic study was asked to
11 be conducted, which we have completed. And it has
12 been submitted to the township clerk, I think. I
13 don't know if the planning commission has received it
14 yet but, in summary, it does say Michigan Department
15 of Transportation information indicates the site
16 abutts Lansing Road, which is considered a minor or
17 major arterial under the MDOT classification system,
18 subject to the issuance of an access permit by MDOT
19 Transportation Center in East Lansing.
20 I could go on, but you have the full blown
21 traffic study.
22 THE CHAIR: Okay. Thank you.
23 Go ahead.
24 MS. BURTON: It is a matter of public
25 record it is not, based on the National Functional
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 31
1 Classification. I don't know about the consultant
2 but the map is out there. And it has been certified
3 by the person who cites the National Functional
4 Classification, from this section to this section, is
5 not classified as the minor arterial. It is an
6 unsigned trunk line that's owned by the State and due
7 to turn back to the county. But that portion that's
8 part of that development is not an arterial.
9 I would look at that closely and look at
10 that traffic study because it is not an arterial
11 based on the definition of this map which was just
12 posted in the last couple months.
13 THE CHAIR: Submitting this for the record,
14 is it safe to call it the National Functional
15 Classification, Eaton County?
16 MS. BURTON: And it is also available on
17 the website, as well.
18 THE CHAIR: Thank you.
19 MR. DORIAN: I would only comment our
20 information is obtained from the Michigan Department
21 of Transportation.
22 THE CHAIR: Would any of my other
23 colleagues like to ask questions? I have a few more.
24 I can ask those at a later date.
25 I have another question.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 32
1 I'm always concerned about infrastructure
2 as we move our township into the 21st century. And
3 I've been very concerned about sewer water treatment
4 facilities. And I'm looking in the audience. Is Ms.
5 Parisian here?
6 MS. PARISIAN: I'm here.
7 THE CHAIR: May I ask you a question?
8 Would you come up front, if you don't mind?
9 THE CHAIR: First of all, thank you. I
10 have a two-pronged question. Have you been
11 approached by the developer about potential sewer
12 facilities for that site and tied with that? Are we
13 in a position for an increased sewage water treatment
14 facility at this point? Those kind of comments,
15 we'll need to know that as we deliberate and move
16 through our discussion.
17 MS. PARISIAN: The sewer board has yet to
18 see a proposal for a plan to this date. I would
19 presume to represent the sewer board or speak for the
20 village counsel.
21 I believe that you're all in receipt of a
22 letter from Wolverine that identifies the residential
23 equivalent units that I required for this
24 development. That's all of the information that the
25 sewer board or the village has at this moment. That
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 33
1 letter states that the facility is capable of serving
2 the property. And that is true on a physical basis.
3 We do have capacity available.
4 On a political basis, that capacity is
5 assigned currently to the existing assessment
6 districts.
7 So the answer to that question is
8 complicated. And I would -- I would hesitate to say
9 much more about that at this time unless you have
10 specific questions regarding the facility or the
11 proposal.
12 THE CHAIR: Thank you. We'll move into
13 that issue a little more in depth as we move to the
14 process.
15 Is Gary Ocello in the audience? The reason
16 I ask for that gentleman, there is some comments in
17 the transcript that states that Eaton County is -- on
18 page 43, 42, that led me to believe that the present
19 4-H facilities there would not up to snuff and
20 satisfactory.
21 The reason I raise his comments is I
22 received a call from some individuals that are
23 leaders in the community of Charlotte, both at the
24 city level and the county board level. And the
25 question to me was, are we -- I assume they were
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 34
1 talking about the township. Are we about the process
2 of trying to pull the Eaton County Fair out to the
3 potential horse park?
4 And I was a little shocked to hear that
5 comment. And I said, "I don't know anything about
6 it."
7 They apprised me of what they have been
8 hearing. And, of course, they are very concerned for
9 a couple reasons. The Eaton County Fair board thinks
10 they are doing an excellent job with the 4-H program.
11 To the best of my knowledge, they are. I don't know.
12 I've not researched that. I've not gone there.
13 The other thing is that is a huge revenue
14 source for the city of Charlotte, a huge revenue
15 source for the county. And also it is tied in with
16 the Frontier Days, I understand, quite a bit. There
17 was some deep concern there.
18 I was as honest as I could be. I thanked
19 them for the call. I said, I'm the kind of person
20 that likes to get the most information I possibly
21 can. I share that with any fellow colleagues so they
22 have the same information I have. And if I make
23 contact with somebody, somebody contacted me, I will
24 also share that with my colleagues. That was the
25 reason for wanting to address that comment of
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 35
1 Mr. Ocello.
2 The other person that made some comment of
3 strong interest addressed this commission. And she
4 spoke specifically to the standards that we have to
5 meet, that the code says that we shall meet. It
6 doesn't say we "may" meet. It says we "shall" meet.
7 She was quite affirmative in her discussion. And
8 since she is a representative of a group of
9 individuals in Windsor Charter Township named the
10 Friends of Windsor Township, and also because she is
11 legal counsel, I feel obligated to allow her an
12 opportunity to make any comment that she may want to
13 make.
14 I see you are in the audience.
15 Is it Smith, LaFeve Smith?
16 MS. SMITH: Yes.
17 THE CHAIR: You may make comments, if you
18 wish, Ms. Smith.
19 MS. SMITH: I'll be very brief. First of
20 all, I want to thank you for the comment that you
21 made earlier that you recognize what your duty is to
22 this community. The planning commission, as you all
23 know, has the duty to represent the interests of the
24 people in this community. While they didn't elect
25 you, they did elect the township supervisor who
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 36
1 appointed you.
2 And also, your other duty is to uphold the
3 ordinances and to make sure that they're administered
4 properly. I want to point out one thing. The
5 ordinance that applies to the decision you have to
6 make in this case is in article 8. It has to be with
7 the special use permit.
8 In making your decision, you have to do it
9 on the preponderance of the evidence. And I know
10 that you all know what that means. But I'm not sure
11 that everybody sitting here does. Preponderance of
12 the evidence is a burden of proof. It is just like
13 in a criminal case when you have -- when the
14 prosecutor has to prove something beyond a reasonable
15 doubt. Preponderance of the evidence means, more
16 likely than not, when you make your decision, should
17 you approve Mr. Lange's application, it must be
18 because it is more likely than not that he has met
19 every single requirement. And I won't belabor my
20 speech here by going over those requirements, but it
21 is impossible for him to do so. So I'm just asking
22 you to keep in mind that your burden is the
23 preponderance of the evidence.
24 And I just would like to make one more
25 comment. I grew up in Potterville. I raised my
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 37
1 children in Potterville. My father was the mayor of
2 Potterville for many years. My father was elected
3 time and time again mostly because the people in
4 Potterville trusted him and relied on him to do the
5 right thing. The biggest legacy my father will leave
6 me is his philosophy which is, when in doubt, do the
7 right thing. And the friends of Windsor Charter
8 Township are asking this commission to do the right
9 thing.
10 Thank you.
11 [ applause ]
12 THE CHAIR: A couple of comments about the
13 people you are looking at in this planning commission
14 body.
15 I've served on another planning commission.
16 I can tell you I served for a number of years. And
17 I'm equally as proud to serve with my fellow
18 colleagues in this commission. You can rest assured
19 we have a fairly astute group of people up here.
20 And, although we make a little mistake and blunders
21 now and then, we are good readers. And one of the
22 reasons we tabled the issue last time was because we,
23 in all fairness, could not make a fair and just
24 decision based on the information that was presented
25 to us at that time.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 38
1 Rest assured we will read the language very
2 closely, very clearly, and do the very best of our
3 knowledge to make the right decision.
4 Having said that, before I ask Mr. Foulds,
5 our planning consultant, to go through his
6 recommendations, I had anticipated, before receiving
7 his report, to ask my colleagues for support in
8 tabling this matter until the August meeting. We run
9 into a little problem with the time line of 60 days.
10 We can deal with that. The reason being with 105
11 pages of transcript and all the other various
12 documents, we've gotten a stack of documents tonight,
13 I can't -- and I don't want to speak for my
14 colleagues, but I can't make the right and correct
15 decision tonight. I've got to read all this material
16 probably four or five times because that's just the
17 way I make decisions. I don't skim over it and pull
18 a straw and run with that. It is a very important
19 issue. It is an important issue for the developer.
20 It is a very important decision for our community.
21 My family, the Martinez family, has lived
22 in Windsor Township for 61 plus years. This is
23 probably the biggest decision I've had to be involved
24 in. I want to make sure I make the right decision.
25 And our colleagues feel the same.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 39
1 I appreciate your comments, but before
2 moving to the planner, in the end I will be seeking
3 to table the issue for another 30 days because we
4 have that total 60 days in the code.
5 MR. MARCH: I've got one question. In the
6 Farm Bureau newsletter we got a month or so ago, on
7 my farm, seeing it hadn't had a history of livestock,
8 recent history of livestock, if I want 500 cows or
9 pigs or any kind of manure-producing animal, I would
10 have to file a plan with I think the DEQ, I think it
11 is, to show what you planned on doing with the manure
12 and runoff.
13 My question was, being a farmer with not a
14 recent history of livestock, if I went out and bought
15 500 horses, cows, or whatever, I would have to file a
16 manure-management proposal with the DEQ, I think it
17 is. And I'm just questioning whether you have to do
18 the same thing.
19 THE CHAIR: Thank you, Mr. Marsh.
20 As you listen to the recommendations made
21 by our planner, Mr. James Foulds, and he's spent an
22 unbelievable amount of time and he does an excellent
23 job in researching and making the recommendation to
24 this commission, you will see some of the many things
25 that need to be answered before we move forward and
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 40
1 make a decision.
2 And, having said that, I'd like to move to
3 Mr. Foulds, if you would, please, and review the
4 recommendations you have made.
5 MR. FOULDS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
6 My report is really more in the vain of a
7 review rather than a recommendation at this point,
8 although our conclusion, as a result of our review,
9 would support your recommendation to take advantage
10 of the full 60-day period to review all the
11 information submitted at the public hearing and
12 additional information as submitted by the applicant
13 at the request of the township or other parties.
14 In brief, Mr. Chairman, in order to break
15 this review down in manageable portions, our initial
16 review took all the requested land uses as part of
17 the application or mentioned in the presentation
18 materials, and there were approximately 18 land uses
19 mentioned, to determine which of those actually would
20 be regulated by the special use permit section of the
21 zoning ordinance and which of those would be
22 regulated by other sections.
23 As a result of that review, again just for
24 purposes of the record, of those 18 uses mentioned in
25 the presentation and application materials, five -- I
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 41
1 should say four of those would be regulated based on
2 our review by a special use permit provision. Those
3 being -- and I'm taking the wording from the
4 application, thoroughbred racing use and other breed
5 racing. Those would be two portions, as well as
6 hotels and motels and, lastly, taverns and bars when
7 they are separate from a hotel or motel facility.
8 So those four uses. It's very clear when
9 the ordinance was reviewed we require a special use
10 permit.
11 Additionally, the campground facilities,
12 that were mentioned during the presentation, could be
13 approved by the planning commission under section
14 5.9.3 (k), which allows you to approve like uses or
15 similar uses to the principal use requested.
16 So, of those 5 uses, that leaves 13
17 remaining from the original 18.
18 Mr. Chairman, the balance of those uses are
19 principal permitted uses in the M1 zoning district
20 which would require site plan review, final site plan
21 review by the planning commission, and no special
22 approval on the part of the township in terms of the
23 uses. So I'm highlighting this information again,
24 for the record. And I emphasize that in our review
25 so that it was clear to the planning commission which
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 42
1 uses you were actually going to be reviewing for the
2 special use permit for a portion, and which uses you
3 were going to be reviewing at a later time possibly
4 for final site plan review. And that information is
5 in our staff review which is dated July 6th.
6 Just to move on from that, Mr. Chairman,
7 please, if you have questions, interrupt me at any
8 time.
9 The site plan review section, which is
10 section 6.8 of the Windsor Charter Township zoning
11 ordinance, would apply obviously to those requiring
12 final site plan review. In addition the M1 zoning
13 district dimensional, regulations which are
14 articulated in the zoning ordinance in several
15 different places, would apply to all the uses, all of
16 the 18 uses proposed and would ultimately be finally
17 reviewed and approved, if that's the township's
18 choice, as part of the site plan review process.
19 That's another layer of regulation that would apply
20 to this process.
21 Finally, Mr. Chairman, the special use
22 permit section, which is section 8.1 establishes six
23 general standards which the four specific land uses I
24 mentioned, which were subject to special use permit
25 review, would apply to. In other words, those six
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 43
1 standards would apply to those four uses as requested
2 in the application based on our interpretation. In
3 order for -- in my judgment, in order for the
4 planning commission to make an informed decision on
5 those six standards for those four special use permit
6 requested land uses, there's a multitude of
7 information that you need.
8 In order to assist you and the applicant
9 and the township, in providing that information, we
10 provided memorandum to the applicant and the township
11 and yourself, Mr. Chairman, which highlighted what
12 information needed to be provided prior to this
13 meeting. My understanding is the applicant's been
14 attempting to provide that information by bringing on
15 board numerous consultants. And, based on my
16 understanding and to put the planning commission in a
17 position within that 60-day time period to complete
18 your review, this is where we stand as I understand
19 it.
20 We currently have, as provided by the
21 applicant, and are in a position to review results
22 from a noise impact analysis, provided by Kolano and
23 Saha Engineers, I just received myself today. I
24 believe it was in your packet or available from the
25 township office.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 44
1 Also, provided was a sanitary sewer
2 evaluation by Wolverine Engineers. That was
3 referenced this evening in a discussion. I know the
4 applicant's engineers will probably want to review
5 the results of that memo so that staff will be
6 talking about the results of that analysis, probably
7 with both engineering entities, so that we have a
8 clear understanding of what the demand is on the
9 township's system.
10 Additionally, a traffic report from Traffic
11 Engineering Associates was dated July 7 has been
12 provided today and will be reviewed by staff as well
13 as hopefully the Eaton County Road Commission and
14 Michigan Department of Transportation staff.
15 Additionally, provided is a lighting
16 analysis dated July 6 by Matrix Consulting and
17 Engineers. That was either in your packet or was
18 provided to you this evening.
19 Also, Mr. Chairman, the emergency services
20 department provided a memorandum to you which was
21 provided this evening and to myself this evening,
22 dated July 12, which identified additional pieces of
23 information about emergency services needed to
24 complete their review. That's just based on my quick
25 review of that memorandum.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 45
1 Lastly, Mr. Chairman, the Board of Water
2 and Light in a memorandum dated July 8 has provided a
3 review with the request for additional information
4 from the applicant and/or the township on the
5 request.
6 So, unless I'm mistaken and there are going
7 to be additional information, this is a listing of
8 studies that have been submitted to the planning
9 commission which you're all going to use to help you
10 make your judgment in evaluating those six standards
11 I referenced previously.
12 Also, Mr. Chairman, we're waiting and
13 hopefully we will be getting storm water run-off
14 analysis at some point even in just general -- some
15 general review by the Eaton County Drain
16 Commissioner's office as well as any manure
17 management and odor control recommendations from the
18 applicant.
19 Also, and finally, Mr. Chairman, we hope to
20 get to clarify this issue of the minor or main
21 arterial question that was raised. We hope to get a
22 final review of that from the Transportation Service
23 Center from the MDOT office in East Lansing, at least
24 as a starting place, and also the Eaton County Road
25 Commission. We will be talking with their respective
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 46
1 staff personnel. And I did also mention the drain
2 commissioner's office, whatever information they can
3 provide.
4 So, Mr. Chairman, that's a review of what
5 information we have, based on my notes, what
6 information we're waiting and what agency we hope to
7 get some additional information from to help you in
8 your evaluation of those six standards for the
9 special use permit as articulated in the zoning
10 ordinance.
11 I'd be happy to answer any questions.
12 THE CHAIR: In your study -- in your
13 summary analysis you have manure, odor impact, and
14 run-off analysis. We've not received any information
15 on that, correct?
16 MR. FOULDS: For me? I have not, no.
17 THE CHAIR: Okay. Madame Clerk, have we
18 received any information in our office on the subject
19 matter?
20 THE CLERK: As of tonight, you have
21 everything I have received.
22 THE CHAIR: Okay. Thank you.
23 Thank you, Mr. Foulds.
24 Are there any further questions or comments
25 from my fellow commissioners?
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 47
1 Hearing none, as I stated before, prior to
2 reviewing Mr. Foulds' very good report, it was my
3 analysis of all the information that we have before
4 us and continue to get in, that it would not be fair
5 for my fellow colleagues, and some of you work
6 full-time jobs, as we all do even though some of us
7 are retired, that this a tremendous amount of
8 information to digest. We couldn't make a rationale
9 decision tonight.
10 I would ask my colleagues for a motion to
11 table until the next meeting and that's also in
12 concurrence with the comments that are made by our
13 planner, James Foulds.
14 Having said that, the chair would entertain
15 a motion for a tabling of this issue until the August
16 meeting.
17 THE CLERK: They can't go to the next
18 meeting because you are violating the 60 days.
19 THE CHAIR: We have a time issue. We'll
20 have to do it a couple of days prior, whatever our
21 limitation runs.
22 THE CLERK: Sixty days ends Monday, August
23 8th.
24 THE CHAIR: We would have to have our
25 meeting August 8.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 48
1 THE CLERK: Jim is not available that day
2 so it needs to be Wednesday or Thursday of the week
3 prior.
4 THE CHAIR: Okay. The motion will indicate
5 to table until our next meeting. And the chair can
6 get together with the clerk and we'll determine what
7 that date is. Then it will be approved with
8 sufficient notice.
9 THE CLERK: I would rather the date be set
10 during the meeting.
11 THE CHAIR: What date would you like to
12 pick?
13 THE CLERK: Wednesday of the week before is
14 fine.
15 THE CHAIR: Okay.
16 MR. BORUCK: That doesn't work.
17 THE CHAIR: How about Thursday? Everyone
18 good on Thursday?
19 MR. BORUCK: That whole week is off.
20 THE CHAIR: Who can't be here the Wednesday
21 before in August?
22 MS. JOHNSON: Is that the day after the
23 election?
24 THE CLERK: Yes, it is.
25 MS. JOHNSON: I don't think so.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 49
1 THE CHAIR: How about Thursday? Everybody
2 good Thursday? Let's go with Thursday. That will
3 give us, what, August 4?
4 THE CLERK: August 4.
5 THE CHAIR: August 4. Okay. The maker of
6 the motion should indicate that we would adjourn or
7 we would table the decision until the next meeting,
8 which is August 4.
9 MR. MARSH: I'll make the motion we table
10 this until our next meeting, August 4.
11 THE CHAIR: Motion made by Mr. Marsh that
12 we table the planning parties limited company issue
13 until our next meeting which is August 4. Do I have
14 a second?
15 MS. PRAY: Second.
16 THE CHAIR: Seconded by Ms. Pray.
17 Discussion on that motion? Hearing none, all those
18 in favor significant by saying aye. All those
19 opposed, nay.
20 Motion carries.
21 The matter is tabled until the August 4th
22 meeting.
23 MS. JOHNSON: I have a question. Does that
24 change the hearing for the Lundbergs to August 4th
25 also?
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 50
1 THE CHAIR: I believe we would have the
2 public hearing at the same meeting.
3 THE CLERK: No. Two meetings.
4 THE CHAIR: Two meetings.
5 MS. JOHNSON: Two meetings. Then one is on
6 the 4th and their's is on the 10th, the Lundbergs.
7 THE CHAIR: On a regularly scheduled
8 meeting. THE CLERK: Special meeting.
9 THE CHAIR: Any other questions?
10 MS. HARRISON: Sarah Hock-Harrison, 141
11 East Quincy Street.
12 Will you make sure and get the notice to
13 Denise Parisian so it can be posted down at the old
14 fire barn so that everyone can know this and that it
15 has been changed, the date has been changed, so that
16 you have the people here to hear you discuss this and
17 give your verdict?
18 THE CHAIR: Our clerk always does the very
19 best to try to get the notices up. We will continue
20 to do the same.
21 MS. HARRISON: It was not posted for this
22 meeting tonight on her little bulletin board.
23 THE CLERK: She is not a posting place of
24 the township. She is her own jurisdiction. It is
25 posted at the library, at the township office. It
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 51
1 was on the website and also at the township meeting
2 room where the regular meetings are held.
3 MS. HARRISON: The township meeting room is
4 in the new fire barn?
5 Okay. Thank you.
6 THE CHAIR: You're welcome.
7 THE CLERK: I will put one down there, if
8 you wish, but they are not a regular posting place of
9 the township.
10 MS. HARRISON: I did not know that. That
11 would be great.
12 THE CHAIR: Is there any other business to
13 come before this body? Hearing none, the chair will
14 entertain a motion for adjournment.
15 The chair has a prerogative. We've had
16 some long meetings. I've had a lot of information to
17 read, so I am going to make a decision for our
18 commission that we do not address any zoning issues
19 tonight.
20 Do I have a second to the motion?
21 MS. PRAY: I'll second.
22 THE CHAIR: We'll adjourn this meeting.
23 All those in favor, signify by saying aye.
24 All those opposed, nay.
25 Meeting is adjourned. Thank you.
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 52
1 (Record closed.)
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 53
1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
2
3 STATE OF MICHIGAN)
SS )
4 COUNTY OF CLINTON)
5
6
7
8 I hereby certify that on the date and
9 at the place hereinbefore set forth, I reported
10 stenographically the proceedings held in the matter
11 hereinbefore set forth, and that the testimony so
12 recorded was subsequently transcribed by me with the
13 use of computer-aided transcription under my
14 direction and supervision, and that the foregoing is
15 a full, true and accurate transcript of my original
16 stenotype notes.
17
18
19
20 DATED: _____________ ____________________________
Deborah A. Spagnuolo
21 (CSR-3664)
Certified Shorthand Reporter
22
Notary Public:
23 County of Clinton
My Commission Expires:
24 September 30, 2006
25
RICHMOND SPAGNUOLO REPORTING 1-877-300-7720 54